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Taldrenites => General Starfleet Command Forum => Topic started by: TraumaTech on May 24, 2004, 09:30:07 am

Title: lyran int's have several diferent costs...why?
Post by: TraumaTech on May 24, 2004, 09:30:07 am
hello taldren...i was noticing the various costs of lyran ints.maybe it's a opplus 3.3 thing,i don't know,but to give some examples   l-cc+=155  no fighters
                l-ccf=177  2 fighters(int's)  int's cost 11 bpv's each

             
                l-cf=166   no fighters
                l-cff=190  2 fighters(int's) 12 bpv's each


                l-ca+=140  no fighters
                l-caf=169  2  fighters(int's) 14.5 bpv's each


                wyn-wpbc=129  no fighters
                wyn-wpbc=169  2 fighters(int's) 20 bpv's each


                l-bchp=198   no fighters
                l-bchf=218   2 fighters     10 bpv each
                l-bcht=238   4 fighters     10 bpv's each  


                l-dnl+=223   0 fighters
                l-dnlp+=232  0 fighters
                l-dnlf=256   2 fighters   16.5 bpv's each compared to dnl+ OR 12 bpv's each compared to dnlp+
                l-dnlt=276   4 fighters    13.25 bpv's each/dnl+ OR 11 bpv's each compared to dnlp+


                i am unable to look and see if this is all an op plus 3.3 thing or if some of this would hold up to different bpv/int with just taldren without opplus 3.3 as i would have to uninstall/reinstall to check.that curious i am not,untill i have to for whatever reason.


 obviously my basic question is why do lyran ints have so many diferent costs,instead of a uniform cost?

                                  ty in advance  


               

 
Title: Re: lyran int's have several diferent costs...why?
Post by: Corbomite on May 24, 2004, 09:51:20 am
Its not just the cost of the fighters in there. There are mech links, deck crews and changes in other systems to figure in too. Not all of them are equal. It depends on the ship and the modifications needed to give it fighters, if any. For OP+3.3 FireSoul is the one to ask.
Title: Re: lyran int's have several diferent costs...why?
Post by: TraumaTech on May 24, 2004, 10:05:48 am
Quote:

Its not just the cost of the fighters in there. There are mech links, deck crews and changes in other systems to figure in too. Not all of them are equal. It depends on the ship and the modifications needed to give it fighters, if any. For OP+3.3 FireSoul is the one to ask.  






i can't say as i agree with this statement.the cost should be the same all the way around.after all,would not these same inpediments effect all races?? also,reagrding"question for firesoul",you are probably right,but if what you initially said is true,the same prob would be in sfc-op too with or without opplus 3.3
Title: Re: lyran int's have several diferent costs...why?
Post by: Corbomite on May 24, 2004, 10:49:00 am
FS and Taldren did not use the same conversion formula. I did a comparisson of BCH to BCV conversions for all the races once. You'd be surprised how much some races payed for so little compared to other races. Combat BPV does not reflect true economic costs for conversions. There is no simple formula. The ISC BCV for example costs 263 compared to a CCZ which costs 229 (inflated by Taldren because of extra useful Plas-I's, it really costs 220) and it loses 4 power and two shuttles for eight fighters. The K-C7V costs 218 compared to a C7 that costs 180 and it loses nothing in the conversion, yet the difference is 38 for the Klingons and 43 for the ISC.
Title: Re: lyran int's have several diferent costs...why?
Post by: FireSoul on May 24, 2004, 11:01:32 am
some ships come equipped with mechlinks, while others are ready to go for PFs. When a ship comes equipped, it's not optional: all designated mechlink tractorbeams must be upgraded to mechlinks for 1 BPV each.

Quote:


l-cf=166 no fighters
l-cff=190 2 fighters(int's) 12 bpv's each



4 mechlinks installed for 4 BPV. INTs are 10 BPV each, but being SFC, not all PFs are installed (usually 2/3rds, round down).

Quote:


l-ca+=140 no fighters
l-caf=169 2 fighters(int's) 14.5 bpv's each



You missed the CAP, phaser refit, which is 144BPV. The CAF should have been 168 BPV with 2 fighters: 4 mechlinks installed and INTs are 10 each.

Quote:


l-bchp=198 no fighters
l-bchf=218 2 fighters 10 bpv each
l-bcht=238 4 fighters 10 bpv's each



INTs are 10 BPVs each. The BCH comes with mechlinks pre-installed.

Quote:


l-dnl+=223 0 fighters
l-dnlp+=232 0 fighters
l-dnlf=256 2 fighters 16.5 bpv's each compared to dnl+ OR 12 bpv's each compared to dnlp+
l-dnlt=276 4 fighters 13.25 bpv's each/dnl+ OR 11 bpv's each compared to dnlp+



Again, don't compare to the DNL+ . the DNLP+ includes a powerpack refit for 9 BPV. The DNLF and DNLT is based on that one, not the DNL+.
So .. DNLF.. 6 mechlinks .. 6 BPV.. + 2 PFs .. I have to admit this ship is a notch too cheapmight recieve a correction.. eventually.  (quickly calculated: 258 BPV instead of 256 BPV)
DNLT. 6 mechlinks.. + 4 PFs..   might be 2 points cheaper than it's supposed to be (278).


The aim is still 10 BPV for the INTs. Taldren-introduced ships may or may not follow this. ie: L-CAF.
Title: lyran int's have several diferent costs...why?
Post by: TraumaTech on May 24, 2004, 09:30:07 am
hello taldren...i was noticing the various costs of lyran ints.maybe it's a opplus 3.3 thing,i don't know,but to give some examples   l-cc+=155  no fighters
                l-ccf=177  2 fighters(int's)  int's cost 11 bpv's each

             
                l-cf=166   no fighters
                l-cff=190  2 fighters(int's) 12 bpv's each


                l-ca+=140  no fighters
                l-caf=169  2  fighters(int's) 14.5 bpv's each


                wyn-wpbc=129  no fighters
                wyn-wpbc=169  2 fighters(int's) 20 bpv's each


                l-bchp=198   no fighters
                l-bchf=218   2 fighters     10 bpv each
                l-bcht=238   4 fighters     10 bpv's each  


                l-dnl+=223   0 fighters
                l-dnlp+=232  0 fighters
                l-dnlf=256   2 fighters   16.5 bpv's each compared to dnl+ OR 12 bpv's each compared to dnlp+
                l-dnlt=276   4 fighters    13.25 bpv's each/dnl+ OR 11 bpv's each compared to dnlp+


                i am unable to look and see if this is all an op plus 3.3 thing or if some of this would hold up to different bpv/int with just taldren without opplus 3.3 as i would have to uninstall/reinstall to check.that curious i am not,untill i have to for whatever reason.


 obviously my basic question is why do lyran ints have so many diferent costs,instead of a uniform cost?

                                  ty in advance  


               

 
Title: Re: lyran int's have several diferent costs...why?
Post by: Corbomite on May 24, 2004, 09:51:20 am
Its not just the cost of the fighters in there. There are mech links, deck crews and changes in other systems to figure in too. Not all of them are equal. It depends on the ship and the modifications needed to give it fighters, if any. For OP+3.3 FireSoul is the one to ask.
Title: Re: lyran int's have several diferent costs...why?
Post by: TraumaTech on May 24, 2004, 10:05:48 am
Quote:

Its not just the cost of the fighters in there. There are mech links, deck crews and changes in other systems to figure in too. Not all of them are equal. It depends on the ship and the modifications needed to give it fighters, if any. For OP+3.3 FireSoul is the one to ask.  






i can't say as i agree with this statement.the cost should be the same all the way around.after all,would not these same inpediments effect all races?? also,reagrding"question for firesoul",you are probably right,but if what you initially said is true,the same prob would be in sfc-op too with or without opplus 3.3
Title: Re: lyran int's have several diferent costs...why?
Post by: Corbomite on May 24, 2004, 10:49:00 am
FS and Taldren did not use the same conversion formula. I did a comparisson of BCH to BCV conversions for all the races once. You'd be surprised how much some races payed for so little compared to other races. Combat BPV does not reflect true economic costs for conversions. There is no simple formula. The ISC BCV for example costs 263 compared to a CCZ which costs 229 (inflated by Taldren because of extra useful Plas-I's, it really costs 220) and it loses 4 power and two shuttles for eight fighters. The K-C7V costs 218 compared to a C7 that costs 180 and it loses nothing in the conversion, yet the difference is 38 for the Klingons and 43 for the ISC.
Title: Re: lyran int's have several diferent costs...why?
Post by: FireSoul on May 24, 2004, 11:01:32 am
some ships come equipped with mechlinks, while others are ready to go for PFs. When a ship comes equipped, it's not optional: all designated mechlink tractorbeams must be upgraded to mechlinks for 1 BPV each.

Quote:


l-cf=166 no fighters
l-cff=190 2 fighters(int's) 12 bpv's each



4 mechlinks installed for 4 BPV. INTs are 10 BPV each, but being SFC, not all PFs are installed (usually 2/3rds, round down).

Quote:


l-ca+=140 no fighters
l-caf=169 2 fighters(int's) 14.5 bpv's each



You missed the CAP, phaser refit, which is 144BPV. The CAF should have been 168 BPV with 2 fighters: 4 mechlinks installed and INTs are 10 each.

Quote:


l-bchp=198 no fighters
l-bchf=218 2 fighters 10 bpv each
l-bcht=238 4 fighters 10 bpv's each



INTs are 10 BPVs each. The BCH comes with mechlinks pre-installed.

Quote:


l-dnl+=223 0 fighters
l-dnlp+=232 0 fighters
l-dnlf=256 2 fighters 16.5 bpv's each compared to dnl+ OR 12 bpv's each compared to dnlp+
l-dnlt=276 4 fighters 13.25 bpv's each/dnl+ OR 11 bpv's each compared to dnlp+



Again, don't compare to the DNL+ . the DNLP+ includes a powerpack refit for 9 BPV. The DNLF and DNLT is based on that one, not the DNL+.
So .. DNLF.. 6 mechlinks .. 6 BPV.. + 2 PFs .. I have to admit this ship is a notch too cheapmight recieve a correction.. eventually.  (quickly calculated: 258 BPV instead of 256 BPV)
DNLT. 6 mechlinks.. + 4 PFs..   might be 2 points cheaper than it's supposed to be (278).


The aim is still 10 BPV for the INTs. Taldren-introduced ships may or may not follow this. ie: L-CAF.