You are forging ahead yet again, Bonk. Web-based shipyard worked fine for me, but its format is clumsy. Perhaps a simple dropdown list with a bid and view button would uncomplicate things. Additionally, the view button leading to the substantial text in the shiplist record is a bit much. Images of the vessel library views of the ships would be more familiar but most likely quite labor and bandwidth intensive. If the information on the ships could be distilled to the type of info presented in the vessel library, that would be simple and ideal. Still text but less of it.
I seem to be getting missions wherever I go, so if the server settings are meant not to generate missions, that has not been my experience. Cool stuff, so far. Looking forward to seeing how all this comes out.
Looked it all over and WOW! Bonk this is good stuff!
I agree with Lepton about the too much text ship info. All we need is the basic ship edit summary with a few more details. A ship graphic or UI layout would help, but not necessary
I got missions only in a few varied hexes of my own space (Rom). None in Fed space. I'd like to see more mission choices... Especially in Neutral and enemy space. (assuming Fed is enemy)
Can you not have a 'Credit' ship in the yard? A bank account per say, so you can trade in your ship on it and then use those trade in funds from your old ship to purchase a better more expensive one?
I also agree with Lepton about the shipyard presentation. Would not a drop down menu or multiple pages seperating ships by class or something make it more organized, neat, and easier to browse? Or something. It does seem clumsy. But it is functional and I am nit picking. You wanted feedback.
All of this is pretty damned cool. The webmap is f*cking awesome, bro. The reports, roster, all that is just f*cking awesome.
I'd like to see more players test.
So, whats the deal with Rom missions not showing in Fed space? (havent tried anywhere else)
Is this a good candidate Bonk for another stab at stress the SQL kit.
Is the DB running on your linux box? If so, it might be an opportunity to test that configuration under higher player load...what do you think?
K, got on and flew around the map... um... no missions are showing up....
That "thing" is a wormhole and won't affect you unless scripted to. The "thing" in the background is a Space Fissure. Same deal there.
Ya, well Bonk, I'm glad you tested and confirmed the fact that you can make a server dole out the majority of missions only when in a PvP element, but can you find a 50-50 balance? The server population is not high, and I'd like to build up some pp. There is not much point in a dyna to peruse the map and do nothing else. It's just too hard to 'catch' someone on. To make matters even more puzzling, is the fact that in PvP... the 2x players wouldnt likely agree on which hex the battle would take place. Unless of course the map is extremely small.
Granted, while missions do show in friendly space from time to time, they do not show up enough. At least to speen much time on the server. In addition the stress test you want to happen wont happen unless we are getting frequent missions.
Now as far as the 'bank account' ship... If you want to swap out your ship for another, I thought it would be easy and faster to have a cheap ship in the shipyard you can bid on and then trade your current expensive ship in so that you now have banked the prestiuge of the expensive ship so you can go buy a better one on the webmap. Essentially you could do this using only the webmap, but in order to do it, you'd need to go to the webmap, buy the ship, logon the server, trade you lod one, log out, buy the one u really want but previously didnt have the cash for, then logon and trade the transition ship in for the ship you wanted.
Well, I checked back on the webmapped shipyards... and there is not much good to purchase at the moment. When does it get updated? How long do I have to wait between cycles?
Also, shouldnt ships that are traded back in show up again in the shipyard>?
For instance, if there was an NHK and a KRCS and I decided to try them both to see which one I liked, 1st the NHK then trading it in on the KRCS, then player number two comes along and both ships are gone from the yards.
Please... more info on how the yards work, please, Bonk.
Can you set it such that when a player's ship is destroyed in PvP it is replaced with the same ship ie you can't lose your ship in combat. You lose the hex DV and you don't get (or lose) PP from the battle. A house rule of all PvP is to the death would change the nature of the game. To offset the shift away from the objective of destroying an enemy players ship you could just have serious (large) VP's awarded for destruction of those ships. Lose a battle cruiser five times and you have lost a lot of VP's. Line ships of course are not worth anything. In this way you can fly anything you want as long as you are prepared to lose the VP's. I'm not really sure I like this idea because there is too much book-keeping. Can the system somehow keep track of PvP wins/losses?
Clarify the shipyard question on if there is ship 'xyz' that when purchased will there still be more?
Lepton, what race r u playing and what enemy space is giving u missions?
Clarify the shipyard question on if there is ship 'xyz' that when purchased will there still be more?
Yes, as many as you can afford. There is no OoB implemented yet. I was thinking about it at work this morning and what I need is a way to count the ships purchased (relatively easy) and a list of how many of each ship is built for the server(/build cycle) to compare against (tough part). If someone wanted to go through the whole of OP+3.4 and set up the appropriate base number of every ship needed for a campaign build cycle, I could make use of it to prototype a full OoB system... otherwise I'll have to do it myself but I'd like to see a standard applied or at least use numbers that make sense and are approved by the community.
Mb its server settings, Lepton. Currently, the Romulans have a non-aggression pact with the neutrals. What is you tension level?
Clarify the shipyard question on if there is ship 'xyz' that when purchased will there still be more?
Yes, as many as you can afford. There is no OoB implemented yet. I was thinking about it at work this morning and what I need is a way to count the ships purchased (relatively easy) and a list of how many of each ship is built for the server(/build cycle) to compare against (tough part). If someone wanted to go through the whole of OP+3.4 and set up the appropriate base number of every ship needed for a campaign build cycle, I could make use of it to prototype a full OoB system... otherwise I'll have to do it myself but I'd like to see a standard applied or at least use numbers that make sense and are approved by the community.
Please define "appropriate base number of every ship needed for a campaign build cycle"..
Clarify the shipyard question on if there is ship 'xyz' that when purchased will there still be more?
Yes, as many as you can afford. There is no OoB implemented yet. I was thinking about it at work this morning and what I need is a way to count the ships purchased (relatively easy) and a list of how many of each ship is built for the server(/build cycle) to compare against (tough part). If someone wanted to go through the whole of OP+3.4 and set up the appropriate base number of every ship needed for a campaign build cycle, I could make use of it to prototype a full OoB system... otherwise I'll have to do it myself but I'd like to see a standard applied or at least use numbers that make sense and are approved by the community.
Please define "appropriate base number of every ship needed for a campaign build cycle"..
Aye, there's the rub... not so easy to do.
The trick is; do I want to limit ship-by-ship or by class? Originally I was thinking ship-by-ship but now thinking to limit by class. To limit ship-by-ship I wanted a list of all the ships and how many of each to allow per build cycle (one week of play)... e.g.:
F-FF 20
F-FFL 10
F-DD 18
F-DDL 6
F-CA 18
F-CC 6
F-BCJ 2
F-BCG 2
F-BCF 2
etc...
What I'm looking for is a good set of "base" numbers to start from, once implemented admins can adjust the number of ships desired for each build cycle or I can automate the adjustment based on economy and VC's using the "base numbers" of each ship available.
Does that make any sense? Is there a better approach? What is really desired? Should I just go by class? (I don't want to really though, leaders should be more rare etc...)
It just so happens that I'm experimenting with enhancing the shiplist with just what you need. Perhaps you should log onto MSN at some point, and I can tell you all about it there instead of here. (not yet because it's not finished)
Bonk, 100% trade in please.
Bonk, 100% trade in please.
Cool, missed that, oops. Will do.
I need to find the settings to stop the base assault missions from coming up in non-base hexes (keeping the draft radius of one...). Diehard, if you see this, do you recall what did it for GW3? was it the settings on this thread?:
[url]http://www.dynaverse.net/forum/index.php/topic,163345843.msg1122434887.html#msg1122434887[/url]
Or were those settings to avoid enemy "allies" in lieu of total war missions?
I did nothing, too much of a pain in the ass to get it woking with both EEK and ED missions.
Ya, well Bonk, I'm glad you tested and confirmed the fact that you can make a server dole out the majority of missions only when in a PvP element, but can you find a 50-50 balance?
Had a draw mission but it flipped neutral to federation though no dv shift. Is this by design?
Here is some hopefully meaningful input for you to contemplate Bonk. First of all, outstanding work on a potential front end application for the SQL kit. If you were Romulan, I would petition the Emperor to bestow on you, the Order of Red Leaf, in recognition for your service to the Empire. This includes the tedium of decrypting the various ?blobs? in the DB. We really need a stress test though to see if your current config is stable enough for ?Prime Time?.
For many years I (and many in the community) have dreamed of a good front end, looks like you are well on your way to making many dreams come true. All of this without Server Kit Source code.
First of all, I like the concept behind CW?interesting to say the least. The shipyard works well enough as an illustrative example of how things could work with an external shipyard. Others have remarked, and I concur that it could use a more efficient way of presenting the data to the user, I do have a couple ideas on potential layout schemes, needs more work before I make it public. One thing that could be done right away, is seed the Ship List with the OOB from Federation and Empire, with refits stock as they become available. I could post it again as a reference for debate on the merits of the Stock FnE OOB versus a Custom Version. There are some here, myself included, that feel the Federation and Empire OOB is all you need, with a little tweak here and there to make it compliant with the number of ships currently available.
Initially, the Map should be seeded with AI in accordance with initial Fleet Composition per Federation and Empire (or player/RM defined if that is preferred). Border Fleets dispersed on the relevant borders, Reserve Fleets on the Starbases as noted and the Home Fleet on the Homeworld. That will populate the Map nicely with AI to hunt and Kill in the area they are supposed to be located in.
New construction should be what is available in the web based shipyard. How do we determine what gets placed there? I am glad you asked that question. First the default build list should automatically be built. I know that is at variance to my beloved Federation and Empire economic rules, but as everyone knows, SFC-OP is not Federation and Empire. Here is I would handle new construction:
Players seed the Shipyard by spending PP to place ships for bid there. Now this might get tricky with the nutters who regularly have 40k plus in the bank, but a simple equation could equalize things, i.e. the more PP a player has in the bank, the more PP it cost that player to request that a specific ship to built so that it could be purchased. It could also be run as bid system similar in nature to the default bid system in the DV. Since the shipyard is ?programmable?, the Federation and Empire Restrictions in ship production could easily be implemented, such as no more than one DN per year. The ?system? would track how many ships were ?ordered? by the players and would automatically restrict illegal purchases such as two DN constructed in a single game year and the like. Overbuilds and build substitutions could also be handled in the same way.
Example, 5 war cruisers are the maximum built using normal cost during a build cycle, but some player wants another one. The end price would be doubled, both for the order (placed in shipyard) and the price of the ship that is purchased is also doubled. Variants would be handled exactly the same with a couple restrictions, only a percentage (admin defined) of available new construction are eligible for conversion during the build cycle.
Say you have 6 destroyers normally built during the cycle in accordance with the OOB. Admin decides that only 1/3 of the total can be constructed initially as variants, that means Four stock destroyers at Normal Prices automatically will populate in the shipyard. Two of the Six are eligible for conversion to variants. If no Player chooses to convert these before the end of the build cycle, they will populate as stock destroyers. Any player could spend PP to convert one of the two before the end of the build cycle, to a legal variant with the corresponding deduction of PP from their account. Once all those that could have been ?selected for conversion? are designated, any further construction of destroyers and subsequent conversion, would be at the overbuild cost both to place in the shipyard, as well as purchase price.
Substitutions to the build list would be handled similarly. Example, if the OOB states you can replace a CA with BCH once per cycle, once a player has done so, the option would not be accessible for another player until the time passes and the choice would become available again.
Server Admins could also use scripting to seed the ship list. Say if one race took a strategic objective, they could get as a reward an extra big ship in the shipyard for their labors.
What else can SQL allow?
How about players spending their accumulated PP to purchase AI ships and spending PP to move them around on the map? That would be very interesting factor in itself and provide another angle to strategic game play as well as give players something else to spend the hard earned PP on. Right Now, the AI is pretty much ignored and treated with disdain, but it does not have to be that way.
How about players moving themselves strategically on the map using the web map, with, of course the necessary expenditure of accumulated PP. This could be restricted, example include player must start at a base/planet and end their movement at a base/planet.
Players could trade PP with each other (say 3 points invested = 1 point to the player) or even with allied players belonging to another race. Think the lend/lease deal with Great Briton and USA during WW2 for an historical example.
Players ?hire? AI Pirates to harass the enemy behind the lines as it were, this might not be workable, but an ideal nonetheless.
Players could spend PP to increase or decrease political tensions. This could include non-allied as well?think propaganda and efforts of diplomacy, all which require funds to be successful.
What about internal development? Player would expend PP and the hex they were in could be improved in some manner. Improvements could be as radical as bringing a Minor Planet on board if 100k donated by players, or increase the DV or Econ of the hex by one for every 10k-50k PP spent. I am certain once things get rolling, others can come up with some other ?uses? for accumulated PP.
umm the convoy mission is messed up. I have only completed it once and that was after the convoys allies showed up.If i kill both escorts first it closes in a defeat.If I kill one escort and kill one freighter it closes in a defeat. If I kill a freighter and then an escort it closes with a defeat. All of these losses cost me 150 pp and no dv shift along with the price of any expendables used. no biggie on the lost pp or any thing it is just an FYI.
Kurok
Missions updated. (space backgrounds changed too!)
Bonk...Reyam and I ran some coop missions, Scored victory but my prestige never increased. It happened on deep space and enemy sweep fyi...